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Author Topic: Order of Training for an unbacked 3 year old?  (Read 616 times)
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ChrissieW
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« on: June 12, 2011, 12:25:57 PM »

Right Daisy is 3 years old in a few weeks and my thoughts are turning towards backing.

I have no intention to have her ridden properly till next Spring, but want to make sure I have all bases covered so it goes as smoothly as possible when the time comes.

My question to all who have ever backed a horse, whether that's one or many, is give me an idea of the order you do things in, list of the things you would want checked off before backing etc.

I'm not looking for the rights and wrongs as I think its so individual for horse and handler, just interested on different opinions on what is essential to have in place and how people go about the process.

I'm enjoying just watching Daisy grow so am in no hurry but have a loose plan of introducing long lines and lunging this summer/autumn and maybe having a rider sit on end of the year but more likely not till spring and certainly not properly ridden to then. However I feel I need to have a more formal idea of my goals and how to achieve them first, so interested in others experiences and order of doing things  Smiley
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Chrissie - West Sussex, UK
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« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2011, 01:09:17 PM »

as well as the lunging/longreining for teaching voice commands and some idea of what the bit means, I'd be making sure that she was happy with all bits of equipment and with it being tried on and adjusted. If you have suitable lanes and take her out in-hand in it so that she is used to how it feels and sounds. Make sure that you do everything from both sides and get her used you being higher than her if possible, also stuff waving about above her etc etc. (basically get her used to everything she will need to be a riding horse save a person on her, then when you get to that point it's the only new thing being introduced. Take your time and don't get disheartened if you have bad days - all young horses will do 'stuff'!
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Simon
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« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2011, 02:51:14 PM »

Well I've done prety much everything myself with my two,I've had them since they were 3 months old and they were 10 last month so here goes. They came to be with their mums as 3 month old foals unhandled so pretty much wild! They were left for a month or two to settle in before handling and then started getting the basics of leading for a while and then taking them for walks with their mums, it certainly helped having their mums to start.

They stated doing 'stuff' as two year olds really, more walking out in hand. seeing the sights and sounds etc, then I can't remember if I stated lunging or long reining first, I have a feeling it was lunging. I began by gradually letting them have a longer line whilst trotting in hand and then doing large circles till they got the hang of it. I did a lot of work off the lunge as well to get them to work off the voice which I think is really important. I think long reining is important as well as it teaches them to go infront of you and gives them confidence, but try it in an enclosed area first until you both get the hang of it, I remember once that one of mine did an arab impression with her tail, span round and clamped her tail down on one of my lunge line, further scaring herself, we were out in a field at the time!

They were sat on as 3 year olds but that was about all they did, which was un-eventfull, they were fine, I think a lot comes down to handling and trust. I did the usual, having a helper they knew to hold them whilst I got a leg up then gradually leaned over then finally got on. They didn't really start proper riden work till they were 4 year olds as they were quite slow to mature, it was then that I started to lear about in hand work from Anna who used to help and teach me, I found it invaluable as all the things we taught them on the ground they picked up straigth away under saddle. So really everyting you want them to do under saddle teach them it from the ground first, it's far easier for both parties. I always find it's best, if not essential, to have somene else to help you out, even if it's just to be on stand-by if sometimg does go wrong.

But generally if you've had them for a good while, you know each other, you've had a good logical, progressional training sytem, it should go smoothly. It's when they get a bit older and wiser you get the problems!

Hope this helps

Simon
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lmevans
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« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2011, 04:10:59 PM »

I see the backing process as a continuum from birth through all their handling and learning up until they're riding away confidently and happily, at whatever age that is finally achieved!

Before beginning work, with any baby I would want body handling to be completely established, ie they're happy to have you touch everywhere with anything, be it your hands or a rope or a lunge whip. Then I would also want them to be completely happy with halter / lead work. So completely clear in their minds about giving to pressure and stopping starting and following/turning in-hand politely and calmly. Ideally these things are established as they grow up from foal to yearling and 2/3 year old, and with Daisy you've had her from early enough that you will have these things already too. Obviously many youngsters are just left almost feral until someone buys them aged three, so they may take a little longer to get the ground basics covered confidently.

I try to aim to have a three year old obedient and calm and happy walking and trotting in-hand on a long rope, listening to vocal commands for forward and slow down, stand and back up, moving over sideways and yielding hind quarters and forehand from a light touch in-hand. Following this, I move on to more advanced commands like basic lateral work in-hand, moving over and opening the shoulder, giving to light pressure aids, crossing the legs and learning to take their balance back over the hindquarters a little. All this is still in a halter or cavesson. I would also want them to be confident, happy and calm away from home, both at exciting places like shows and just walking out on mini in-hand hacks seeing the world and meeting traffic/wildlife/other riders etc etc.

As for introducing equipment, given the opportunity I do this from birth onwards too. Then it no big deal about what comes out of the tack room and where it ends up being put  whistle Both Tonka and Orio have been with me from birth and both have had the same treatment. Both have had numnahs plonked on them from very early, had things round their bellies, on their heads, under their tails, round their legs, all over. Orio used to "wear" my saddle on top of his rug aged 6-9 months while I shut the gate into the field as he used to meet me at the gate on arrival and walk with me to the stables  laugh As a result, he is utterly calm and confident with any equipment on and around him, and I would expect no issues at all when he comes to be saddled later. Tonks was the same, backing him was "just another day" in his viewpoint!

Next stage for me in the learning curve for them is learning all the same stuff they did in-hand, but at a distance. So on the lunge or loose. After that, I introduce a bit on a light headstall and repeat all the in-hand and lunge/loose work (but without actually touching the bit yet). Finally, I start in-hand work with the bit. Introducing contact, encouraging the horse to mouth the bit and feel it and get an idea of how to hold it and respond to it. Then I repeat all the in-hand work above but introducing the reins as an aiding tool and converting the movements from voice and hand pressure to reins/bit and hand pressure.

Once they've got the hang of working in-hand and on the lunger going forwards, sideways, stopping etc with a light rein acceptance I would consider chucking a body over the top and introducing weight on their backs. Then progressing to walking forwards (lead at first, then lunged) and stopping under the weight, running through all their familiar exercises from their ground handler, but with a rider weight on board. Then once they're happy with the weight and its visual, physical and emotional impact on them and their movement and balance (which usually only takes a couple of ten minute sessions if they're well prepped), I start letting the rider apply the requests with light rein contact and leg, transferring the control over from ground handler to rider. I find if they've done the in-hand work enough, they already understand leg aids and are happy to accept the rider controlling them pretty quickly.

From there I usually then leave the school work alone for a bit and hack out gently, building fitness and strength and confidence with their rider before I ask anything more demanding in the school. I'm a big fan of turning youngsters away for a holiday after they're backed and hacking out nicely. How long for depends on the individual/time of year/facilities etc but I think it gives them time to think things through and they come back more mature and stronger and ready to go on.

I won't back Orio until he's four. He's still growing like a weed, and is still so lanky and leggy that I don't think he'll fill out and be mature enough until he's four  rolleyes  but he's been shown in-hand and does basic in-hand work with enthusiasm and obedience. He has worn a bit (twice  laugh ) but with no contact on it, walks out in the Forest, deals well with other horses and riders, wild ponies, cows, pigs, donkeys, water crossings, hills, gates, open moorland, traffic, travels well in his trailer and it is always commented on at shows how confident and polite he is  wub He has a very active mind and enjoys playtime in the school with me. We usually work loose or in a head collar and he is incredibly clever, so keen to please, he's adorable! I do stuff with him probably once a fortnight. He's always keen to be caught and is gutted if I take one of the others and not him out of the field, so I take that as a sign that he doesn't feel overloaded!

Tonka was very different. He is clever but only on his terms  doh clicker has worked wonders with him though, greedy sod  rofl He wasn't backed until he was almost 6, so was a very late starter. I sat on him at four and he felt drunk. He is a BIG horse and he just hadn't got the hang of his own body yet at that stage. I probably could have got back on at 5, but I destroyed all the ligaments in one knee and had a lot of time off riding, so he got another year off  rolleyes By six he was totally confident in his own body and could balance himself properly. He was 100% better in-hand and on the lunge and when I got on he was fine. He hasn't looked back once  Cheesy and I'm glad I waited for him to be properly ready. I still do a lot of in-hand work with him, and I find it really helps to teach him new things from the ground first before attempting them under saddle, as well as giving me the opportunity to watch him move and keep an eye on how his balance and engagement is progressing. I don't think that the ground work should stop just because you've got on board. It is useful and helpful as part of their ongoing learning throughout their ridden careers. I still work Noos in-hand and she's 17!


Gosh, that turned into a bit of a ramble, sorry  Embarrassed 
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winnieandben
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« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2011, 06:52:37 PM »

So hard to put it all in words but my usual is : in hand hacking, lunging, long reining, in hand work, back to lunging in full tack, then rider belly over and sitting on, then basic stop start steering ridden and then gentle out hacking with a mix of in hand and ridden, turn away til 4.

Then back to in hand, lunging and long reining and re back and hacking and basic ridden schooling.

Hope that makes some sense.  Most of all go with the flow with the horse and what they are confident with and offering you on that day  thumbs  Take each day at a time be prepared for 2 steps forward one step back, and most of all enjoy the journey it is so rewarding  thumbs
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« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2011, 08:50:26 PM »

what w&b said nod.  in fact all the posts here are great thumbs
i like backing at 3-3 1/2, then turning away for the winter to be restarted under saddle at 4.  altho i do keep up a lungeing and hacking out in hand *light* regimen thru winter.
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Trish - North Carolina, USA

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« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2011, 08:55:56 PM »

Great essay Lucie  thumbs
My advice is to break everything down into such small chunks that nothing causes any disturbance atall and act as if everything you do is totally fine.
Not much I can add really, I think all bases have been covered.
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ChrissieW
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« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2011, 08:11:57 PM »

 thumbs thumbs Thank you so much guys, exactly what I needed.

Gives me a little mental list of what I've already achieved and what to move on to next.

Thanks Lucie, your post was fab, really helpful.  thumbs

I think we've got most of the basics in place now, need to work more on sideways yielding and more loose work I think for now.

Leading, halting and voice commands for halt, walk and trot all in place, and standing at block so I can loom and pat and treat over her back.

Completely agree about small chunks, I need that, let alone Daisy. In fact think I need it more as Daisy is a faster learner than I am!  laugh
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Chrissie - West Sussex, UK
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« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2011, 08:16:51 AM »

With mine from the ages of 2 till 3 they were introduced to all sorts of tack, I also did anything "scary" that might happen later (stirrups being left down and being a tad flappy etc, nothing that would hurt him just trying to spook him if it can be done wink ) did some long lining, vocal aids were learnt grooming up high from a mounting block.

The summer they are 3 I then do the leaning over, then leaning over and being led, then sitting on and being led, eventually going for a couple simple hacks with a person for them to either follow or being led (at this stage we have already long lined down the routes we want to hack. This is all done in walk under saddle.

Then turn away until 4.

This year Ted for example has learnt so much already, 4 has been his big year, he has grown up mentally a lot, he still has some growing to do but we are still taking it easy with ridden stuff, he can walk, trot, canter and leg yield and we focus on getting that just right. Smiley He has been lovely to back and is a very clever pony.

I wish you all the best with your process and hope to read about the progress!! Cheesy
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