Young horse balance debate!

[acb.antonia]

I've recently bought a 4 year old hanoverian called Woody.  He'd been lightly backed at the end of last year and then left until we started working with him in May/June time.  We were riding him a couple of times a week up until last week and have now started to build up to 4 days a week.  

When Woody first came he was very nervous and tense.  The first few times I rode he tucked his chin in and didn't want to seek the contact at all.  After a few weeks of patient, relaxed work (walking around the arena allowing him to stretch if he wanted to, light trot work on big circles etc) he started to stretch forward and out albeit on the forehand.

This is where the debate starts!  I feel that because he needs to learn to stretch forwards (think whoever backed him may have pulled the head in or even used draw reins), I want to be extremely careful with the hand contact (which I am already quite sensitive about, I much prefer Anja Berans light work to that of, say, Paul Belasik- both nice work but I prefer Anja's lighter contact).  I have focussed on getting the relaxation (which is nearly there) and am now starting to focus more on balance and rhythm but only using my weight/seat aids and not much hand.  The aids I give with the rein are opening for guiding a turn and I like to allow Woody to find the contact rather than trying to keep the contact on.  I am now in a debate with my Mum (who owns Woody!) about Woody being crooked. Here is her side of the story...

I agree with everything above and also prefer the Anja method, I am very cautious that we build Woody's confidence and strength with sensitive training and think the work to-date has been just right.  However even though he is now relaxed and moving forward with more rythmn, the greater percentage of the time he is moving with his head and neck to the outside - Antonia believes that this is okay and he is balancing himself, I am concerned that he is building muscle in the wrong place and putting strain on his limbs if he continues to move crookedly.  I believe that any correction should not interfere with the relaxation and rythmn she has achieved to-date and importantly I don't feel she should be putting his head in place.  However I am concerned that she should be providing him with some guidance as my thoughts are that potentially he will not achieve balance in himself when his is crooked throughout his frame.  My thought are to provide small adjustments (not pulling  his head straight) but a guide and then reward and give immediately to re-inforce.

So that's Mums view.  I am still concerned that asking him to look to the inside at the moment isn't necessary as I'm constantly asking him to readjust his balance with my seat and feel that even guiding his head to look more to the inside will interfere with him finding his own balance.

So we would like a referee to call time on the debate!  What are your opinions and ideas about the best thing to do in these circumstances?

[issywizz]

I agree with your mum 
Ride the *whole* horse,this includes his head and neck,dont be afraid to correct the head and neck *aswell* as the rest of the body.
As far as the on the forehand stuff is concerned, ask him to soften to the hand and ride transitions and half halts asking him to engage his back end,again,dont be afraid to correct the balance just because it means using the reins aswell.

[shoveltrash]

an easy way to *fix* this would be to initiate a correct lungeing program.  and yes, i agree with your mum too.....and of course issywizz

[acb.antonia]

We have started lunging too.  At first we were told that he got a bit speedy on the lunge and I thought he was going to need retraining with it so I left it but now we do about 10 mins before we ride and it is definately helping him find his balance and we're now putting a ple out, too.

However, are you sure you agree with my Mum!!  I should stress, Woody is still really unbalanced and can't even walk and trot in a straight line.  If he is still only just learning that the inside rein guides him into the turn, don't you worry that if I start trying to coax his head to the inside that it will create confusion with the inside rein?? 

[issywizz]

No,I think you need to be clear with your aiding but I dont think that riding him round crooked is a good idea so still agree with your mum,sorry 

[Woody]

when I had a sore teeth issue with my youngster I used increasing and decreasing circles as a way of helping the balance  - still very large circles but paying very careful attention to my inside shoulder - at these times his mouth was so sensitive I had to use extremely gentle contact. I am much more interested on them standing up correctly on their shoulders than necessarily what the head and neck are doing.

[acb.antonia]

Yes, I agree Woody.  It's not that I'll never ask him for inside flexion, just think it'll be a few more weeks before he's ready.  The head and neck will come, just not yet. There will always be differing opinions on everything, I'm not using side reins either, I've just got different view on them (particularly for this horse) from the rest of the world!

[ros]

Agree with the others and Mum. I'm also wondering exactly why he's so obviously crooked?

[Heather]

I agree with your Mum too Antonia. I would have started him on in hand work too- nothing better to help straighten a young horse without even a rider on board. But to let him get into a habit of going counterflexed will 'set' the muscles in this way and they you will have to stretch them again. He needs to learn the use of the outside rein to bring the forehand around- will work on this with you at the Birtle clinic I have no doubt!

[acb.antonia]

  My Mum is so pleased with your replies!  I will be interested to hear what you think of him at the clinic Heather.  He isn't actually crooked, what happens is he is all wobbly and doesn't know where to put his body, I guide him with my seat and do use the inside rein to guide him but he is still very wobbly around corners and his rhythm is always changing etc so he loses his balance and puts his head to the outside.  I correct it with my seat/weight (otherwise I would be using my inside rein so often that he would get annoyed) but he loses his balance often and so it isn't obvious how much work I'm putting into correcting him- My Mum must presume I'm doing nothing.  I still really think that just at the moment the inside rein will confuse him.  Maybe when you see him Heather you will still disagree with me, in which case I'll drop my case and accept that he does need inside flexion. 

When I rode yesterday he was really improved.  We've started lunging over poles (a pole) and this is helping him find his balance.  He is tending to ride in a straight line now so I feel like I will ask for more from him but just a little at a time.  My Mum is just a backseat driver    I should warn everybody else out there to not train with your own mother, it's a recipe for argument! 

I wish I was more experienced with in hand work but I'm not and since I can ride better than I can work in hand, I just stick to riding.  I'm hoping to learn though.

Thanks very much for taking the time to reply to us, even if I do like you all a tiny bit less for it     

[acb.antonia]

p.s. Heather, when you say about using the outside rein to bring the forehand round, do you mean keeping the contact and placing it on the neck?  That's something I do, I think.

[night-mare]

Another one here for your mum i'm afraid and i have just been through this with my large youngster. I quietly perservered through a very wobbly stage  with gentle inside flexion and hundreds of transitions /half halts on large circles , giving lots of little reminders for the flexion on a soft  almost loose contact, working in a slow rhythm so she could find her own balance.  I feel that if you allow your boy to find his balance with his head to the outside then he is just going to have to unlearn it all and start again to the inside.
But then i'm a mum too

[Belbe]

i'd seriously advise a lot of work in hand to straighten him out, that way you can fix him without your added weight to spoil his balance. I've started this with my colt just now and am fast starting to forget wich side was the crocked one! 

[acb.antonia]

It's not that he's crooked, my Mums worried that he will be crooked if I don't ask for inside flexion.  At the moment he is moving increasingly straighter but when his heads looks outside (when the balance goes) I try to correct it with my weight. 

I wish I was more proficient with in-hand work, I'm sure you're right and it would help him immensely but all I do on the ground at the moment is lunging.

[Claire]

another agreeing with you mum

and get Becky  out for the in hand work