SRS cavesson pics for Pikku

[Pikku Karhu]

Thanks HH, the removable slip for attaching a bit sounds like a good idea... may incorporate that to my design 

[issywizz]

HH has got the one I would have bought if she had found it before I bought mine! 
It looks as if the nose is jointed in the same way? whats the padding like? and does it stay put without slipping if its done up loose?
The SRS one do 2 sizes,standard which should fit most Iberians/Lippis and large which would be for bigger noses as much as anything I think.
B has the standard which is equivalent to a full size but I wouldnt want the nose any narrower.

[happy-horses]

lol poor Issywizz I asked her about a million cavessons before I ordered that one! 
Its Busse not Wells, it looks pretty similar tbh, working tonight but I'll get some pics tommorrow  It doesn't slip and I dont do it up tight at all, theres pics of my boys modelling it on my blog. The only thing is the straps for the bit are to short for splash but wouldn't be dear to get it spliced 
Its not as flash as the SRS one though 

[issywizz]

No its not as pretty  but I only bought the SRS one because it was the only one that I could find that was linked that way-couldnt get the Wels without a long wait and they are about the same price ( and not as pretty  )
You are better at internet shopping than me. 
Mind you it was my christmas pressie to myself. 

[Wendy]

It could be just me - but I'm finding it a bit frustrating that they don't explain how the different designs actually work.

I have been reliably informed - if I remember it right - that the wells is the one to have because of the the noseband is jointed in the middle, where the awful everyday (cheapo) ones have more than one joint which is why they are so badly fitting/slippy. But none of these give any info on that.

Even the Beran one which looks really nice has no info about the set up of the noseband. 

http://www.anjaberan.de/english/boutique/bridlework/shop/kappzaum/

[issywizz]

No Wendy its the complete opposite.
The Wels and the SRS ones have no joint in the middle but a joint on either side.The idea is the same as the single jointed snaffle versus the lozenge type,ie; the single joint gives a nutcracker action to the (very sensitive) bridge of the nose and therefore discourages the horse from working into the contact.
The double joint gives a softer smoother action and also sits more stable on the nose.
ETA yes its very frustrating trying to work out what each one is! I had to email the SRS people. 

[Wendy]

Ahhh that makes more sense.

But why on earth that is not in their advertising literature is a mystery...

[issywizz]

Heres another one somebody has sent me a link to on facebook;
http://www.quintasaddlery.com/webstore/product_info.php/info/p1170_Portuguese-brass-lunging-Cavesson.html
Also apparently the one Anja uses is a plain serreta-no joints and no padding ,presumeably unserrated though in which case it will be the same as my showing one for B-lovely but a bit hard for encouraging them to work into the contact.Maybe its better for French school? 

[chapsi]

The Portuguese cavesson has a non-jointed metal, unserrated noseband, simply covered in leather.
Anja Beran is likely to use one, as she trained (and still does) with Manuel Jorge Oliveira

[baggywrinkle]

What is the difference in action/effect between the SRS beauty and the usual unhinged( ) Portugese type?
And Simon Battram said elsewhere that the 'SRS' he has bought is not the same in use as those he used when at the SRS, but he can't say what the difference is to look at. Unhinged, not unhinged???? (praps i'd best say 'non-hinged'!)
Anyhoo.....the difference in action between the 'SRS' and the plain Portugese arc is my Q!

[Cloud_cirrus]

On the SRS cavesson, what is the purpose of the brass bits that stick out of the leather behind the last ring on either side, is that part of the hinge that you can see?

With the rings, do they all swivel or are they fixed?

I somehow (completely unplanned) managed to by a second hand Wells cavesson, it's really old leather and probably not got a lot of life left in it but it is amazing the difference in feel that it gives you.

I am now trying to buy just the Wells metal bit and make my own in Saddlery class so if any one ever comes across somewhere to buy that bit only, it would be much appreciated.

[baggywrinkle]

Can anyone show a pic of the Wels pattern for comparison?
c-c......can you use the metal parts you have now and re-do the leather?

[issywizz]

Hiya,
Baggywrinkle, the double hinges either side ( yes thats what the sticky out bit is) give more flexibility than the fixed one but without creating pressure points on the bridge of the nose.
Although I would think the bigger difference really as far as the horse is concerned is that the Portugese style ones tend not to be well padded and therefore teach the horse to hold itself off the contact rather than come into it.
I think this must be an Iberian training thing given their early use of the curb also.
I also read Simons comments on the cavessons,its a shame he didnt/couldnt explain the difference as I was intrigued,however he said that the original gave more control which is not what I ever use a cavesson for myself anyway as I prefer to train for control using a small arena and a free horse.
Yes the rings swivel CC.

[Cloud_cirrus]

Thanks Sarah.  Re-using my old one is possible Baggywrinkle however the metal noseband parts are quite rusty and only the middle ring swivels, the other two are fixed. 

I reckon it is probably a good 40 years old and ideally I would like to change the design slightly, I would like it to have a headpiece that buckles on either side, so I could use multiple head pieces with it to fit everything I have from 11.2hh to 16hh.  I would also like to insert a triangle piece of leather on etiher side to hold the noseband piece up, even though it does actually fit very well.  I would also like to have the option to double buckle the noseband piece so it can also be used for smaller horses although probably it wouldn't be an issue if I just had lots of holes on the noseband.

Alternatively, I could just make three different ones in Pony, Cob and Full, however at my current rate of output that could take quite a long time!!

[sixfootblonde]

Sorry, couple of questions - how tight would you do the Portuguese cavesson?  Would you do the Wells as tight?  I have not read all of thread, but is the SRS a Wells?  

Sarah - free horse, small arena, train for control.  Interesting!!  Can you give me some idea what type of work you do?