rein back

[Appy2quarter]

Having read this thread yesterday, I had a play tonight with Hylo.  Usually I have a slight incline forward and - for want of a better way of describing it - I feel the weight going down into my thighs.  Having said that, he was trained western so had learned to go back with a real lean back...and consequently used to back up with his head in the air and a hollow back.

So, we were practicing halt-trot-halt transitions and I then added rein back.  Remembering what had been written here, I had the same 'feel' in my seat but imagined my chest opening and my shoulders very slightly asking for the reinback.  Interestingly he knew immediately what I was asking for, and stayed nice and round and soft.

Now, I'm guessing I therefore hadn't changed anything in my seat but could also argue that I only asked when he'd already halted softly and to - rather than on - the bit.  In other words, he was very well set up for it.

Sorry, very waffly but VERY interesting thread!!

Jayne, re the canter, do you mean you'd start by asking for canter from the inside leg (as I think Heather advocates) or that you wouldn't ask this way?  I seem to recall Heather mentioning that if the horse only learns to canter from the outside leg back, it can get confused between travers etc and canter departs.

[ludlu]

Oh crikey, can we start a new thread for canter, my brain is really VERY NEARLY FULL and its so hard to trace these threads when we get posting so much! 


Exciting it worked, I can't WAIT to try tomorrow.  I, uncharacteristically,  , admonished a small child attemping to rein back on the yard to night.  He told me that the YM, who won the local dressage at the weekend, told him you HAD to saw to teach them  .  His mother is really into everything I do so she let me show him a better way.  He's only little and oesn't care so long as his pony goes FAST  :'( but his sister seems interested and can't stop watching T on longlines......there is hope for one of them!

[Fiona]

Really uselful thread, thanks guys 

Experimenting recently with rein back, what has really worked with Jörð is to incline my body forwards as per usual, then move my shoulders back by an inch or so. Presto - instant rein back 

This is a mare who is intensely worried about "contact". She can't work happily in a bit at all, and even in a hackamore she prefers it if my hands are absolutely still and I just ride from my seat.  The shoulders back method is far preferable to vibrating my fingers for her, so thanks for planting the seed 

I was thinking, she'd probably be good at garrocha work, or at least she could work with the reins attached to my waist    I've so far not met a horse who wouldn't lean on a fixed contact, but she seems to need to know exactly where her rider is to feel secure.

And Becky, if you're reading this, I know exactly what you mean about them feeling like a wind-up toy.  You can wind her right up with walk - rein back - tölt transitions until the tölt is fantastic - so much energy expressed without escaping into speed    I am SO enjoying this work with her 

Fiona

[JayneH]

I think the most important bit which you guys have worked out is that you're not relying on the reins to reinback - hmm I've just look at what it's called how misleading

The other important thing is that when they do rein back that you don't pick up the reins more because you will put the horse on the forehand when you walk off.

re canter: the reason that I ask for canter with the outside leg (with the inside leg acting as a passive wall) is because it is the outside hind that is the first step of the canter.  Also why I teach flying changes with the 'outside' leg as the aid for canter. It is the hind leg that makes the change.

[Appy2quarter]

Thanks Jayne - its such fun playing with these things!  Fiona, Joro sounds fabulous!!!

re the canter transitions, how do you ensure they do not get confused with travers etc?  I have tended to ask for quarters in with my seat (taught by an NH clinician and hadn't done it any other way before) so I find asking with the outside leg is okay but I know a friend of mine came unstuck when she taught travers because then when she asked for canter she got that instead! 

Is it about your intention?  ie you are thinking 'up' in your energy and your inside hip is forward for canter whilst for travers its around the leg.. (oh, can't explain what I mean properly!!!)

[Heather]

I think the most important bit which you guys have worked out is that you're not relying on the reins to reinback - hmm I've just look at what it's called how misleading

  You are right there, Jayne, but also correct in that the main thing is NOT to use the reins- what a dichotomy!!

Heather

[bonny]

I managed to rein back 

Stopped when we were nearly home which put Bons into major strop and we did a bit of Miss Piggy mane tossing untill she agreed to stand still.  Hadvery little contact in scawbrig bridle, leant foward a fraction,moved shoulders back a wee bit and just lightly touched her with both legs.  My movement were so small but she immediatly took a couple of straight steps back. 

I'm still in shock.    How can it have taken me 4 yrs to do something so effectively so easily 

Is this my first classical movement?   If so little fat highland pony and smirking rider will soon be seen reversing all over the place.

All joking aside, I once stewarded at the rein back phase at a trec competition.  Only one horse, a big cob with soup plate feet, backed correctly between the poles.  There were very few who could even manage one or two steps and most could not back at all.

[Claire]

well, i haven't got there yet, but i'm SO pleased i asked the question.

now, one thing - do the fingers just "not allow" forwards, or what?  I get the "no aid with the hand, don't pull the horse back" but apart from that?