Another loading question

[1 morejump]

Okay, so a little background first.  Lance has never been very good at backing out of the trailer, he fell out once and we have been working back up to it.  However, he does need to know how to load.  He has a surgery on the 16th and I do not want to fight him to get there and back. 

We started by clicking everytime he got up to the trailer and he will now go half way in and just stop.  I thought a new method would help so I started target training and that works but when he gets half way in he won't budge.  His back feet are planted and will not step up no matter how much I ask him to move he just wont.  He isn't afraid of the the trailer anymore, just backing out, he knows that if he puts both feet in he will have to back out and he doesn't want to do that.  How do I overcome that?

[intouch]

Don't suppose you could borrow a front unloader?  Frustrating!

[Hat Dancer]

How is he with backing up on the ground? Does he do that easily? Could you put poles on the ground and start him backing up around that labyrinth? That might sort any issues he has got with backing up.

Once on the ramp, when he is stuck, keep the pressure on, but walk from side to side on the ramp, so his neck needs to move with you .. but keep a constant (not harsh by any means) but constant pressure on. And once you have him in the trailer, back him back out again, and reload him immediately, and do that about 10 to 15 times? And repeat daily for a while.

Fingers crossed that that works for you! 

[Moses]

Hi ,

You say he is going in for surgery ? Is it anything that would make backing up difficult for him ? If he has any problems with his back , legs or feet , it may be difficult for him to actually back down a ramp in the first place.Presuming this is not a factor I would start as the other post said and work in a flat field or menage backing up , then going over poles , Laberinth ect. Backing over different textures such as a board , plastic ect ect. When he feels very confident with this I would then try backing him down a grassy slope ,which is smooth so he learns how it makes his body feel.This will also help to show up any uncomfortable aspects in his body.If he can do all this happily then move on to the trailer work.I would however say though that I am only happy working with trailer issues and the clicker when the horse is completely free with nothing on his head atall.I would have done all the above training also completely free.When working with the clicker , the horse has to know he can choose to participate or not with no consequences.As soon as you put anything on his head or even a rope around their neck , you are taking the choice away from them.Truely free shaping these behaviours is the only way you will be able to know for sure that your horse is completely happy with what is being asked of him and not being co-erced into doing something for whatever reason.Using a headcoller and putting pressure on it when he isn't moving forward is a very different training method to using a clicker and the horses can easily become confused and non compliant.

Anyway just my thoughts for what they are worth
Rach.
Good luck.Let us know how you get on.

[Moses]

Oh just one more thought , If you do suspect he may be uncomfortable in his body ,getting a front unload trailer is the only fair way to go with him until the problem is sorted out I reckon 
Rach

[Jolene]

His club foot he's having surgery for is on the front, right?  He should be able to physically to it, I would think.  And I'm assuming you're loading into a step-up, otherwise there wouldn't be much of an issue and you'd have mentioned using the ramp.  Is there any chance you can get someone to build you a 'bridge' like they use in western trail classes?  This is the best way I know to train to get in/out of a step up when the horse has an issues with the stepping up/down.  You can get something like a pallet and reinforce it and put plywood on top (all screwed down, of course) and then teach him to step up and down from it, and you can add a cue so that he knows when he's actually stepping down, this is how I've always taught mine to get out of these trailers without scrambling.  I usually say, "And DOOOOOWN" when they're going to step that last step out, so they know they're going down.  Is there any chance you could borrow an open stock so you could turn him around if it is actually his hoof causing an issue?  That usually works as well.

[shoveltrash]

can you borrow a stock trailer to work on it?  at least with a stock, you can walk him up, turn him around & walk straight back out......once there, you could work on backing up just one step at a time without the pressure of it being the ONLY way to get off!

[1 morejump]

Thanks for all the advice!
The trailer is most deffinatly the type where you have to step down, no ramp. Anything with a ramp was too expensive and my parents would never splurge for a new trailer.  I have been kicking around the idea of renting a stock trailer for the surgery and a couple days before to practice in it.  The more I think about it the more I think that will be the way to go and then work up to our trailer.  I don't know if our truck can haul a stock trailer though. *sigh* I am going to be broke by the time all this is over, and I only have a couple weeks left. :(

Oh yeah, the surgery is on both of his front feet.  You can go to my training journal http://www.enlightenedequitation.com/ee/boards/index.php?topic=21421.0 for a more complete description and x-rays.  So maybe if I got a stock trailer I could back it up to a hill and walk him straight out.  Right now I am not worried quiet so much with being correct as not putting pressure on his legs post surgery.  I have backed him out once and he got really tense up front when his back legs went down and I am not sure that will be really good for legs that have just been operated on.