Snaffle Versus Pelham

[KathyGrant]

I have read Heather's book and read all the postings on Pelham's. I understand the possibility of a pinching action when using a jointed snaffle (or any jointed bit), but a mullen mouth snaffle does not have this effect.

I have read in numerous books and magazine articles, as well as in discussion with very experienced riders/instructors, that Pelhams are severe bits which must only be used by riders who have sensitive hands. It is also interesting that they are not allowed in dressage tests.

Surely there is a great danger of a novice rider, with perhaps a not-too-secure seat, who gets a horse, reads the book and decides to put their horse in a Pelham and ends up inflicting pain and damage to the horses mouth?

When is someone judged to be experienced enough to use a Pelham? What are the criteria for using one? Is further schooling of the horse (and rider!) an alternative to needing a Pelham?

I speak from a postition of complete ignorance, not being a horse owner, and only ever having ridden horses with snaffles. I would really appreciate someone giving me all the facts, so that I can judge for myself, as I have to confess to being rather confused by this issue!  :blink:

Kathy.  

[Pete]

Kathy  

It helps if someone shows you for the first time - also, you have to know how to judge whether it is necessary or working.  Sarah B is a great example - she'd bought the pelham but waited until I could get down to her yard and show her.  She had a session with my  horse first, just learning to handle the reins and learning the'feel' she needed, and on sunday she was an absolute star.  She had a super lesson with Mike Aylemore on saturday which helped a lot too - Mike rode in the pelham and established the horse with it, and on sunday she went so well - I'm proud of her.  In short, and I'm certain Heather will agree with me, you do need a bit of help first - inexperienced riders could well hurt the horse, but once you are shown, and are aware of what it is doing and how, its really very hard to cause any hurt.  The whole idea of the pelham is to get the horse used to relaxing the lower jaw and coming onto the bit.  Once that happens, you gradually ease onto the snaffle, and drop the curb rein, hopefully once and for all.

Hope this helps - if you need help, where are you?  We might be able to suggest someone to give you some tips from your area.

 

[Rachel]

A pelham can be a severe bit, but a snaffle can also be a severe bit! They're only as gentle as the hands that use them. Personally, I would rather have a novice rider use a pelham only on the top rein then use a snaffle at all, as there is no pinching. I'm not sure if this is correct, but I feel far more damage and pain can be inflicted using a snaffle bit then a pelham.

I still fail to see why BD won't allow pelhams, but they are very strange folk there anyway! (I'd have thought the whole idea of dressage would be to use less rather than more tack as you progressed?!)

Also, the pelham is NOT a short cut in training. Nor is it a substitute for correct training. But correct training using tack (including a bit) which the horse likes and is happy with will usually give faster results more easily. For me, feeling the difference of a horse in a snaffle to a pelham fixed it into my head - snaffles are not the bit for many horses.

Hope this helps your confusion!

Rachel

[Pete]

Thanks Rachel - totally agree!

Pete

[Sarah B]

Hi Kathy

Just to add to the comments above, you are right - there is always the danger of a novice rider over-reaching themselves and allowing their enthusiasm for progress to exceed their current skill level - we all want to be able to do the more experienced stuff .... now! Just about any tack used can have a negative impact on the horse if used in inexerienced and enthusiastic hands

I have started riding my boy in a pelham - at walk and trot for now with lots of transitions.  However, on Friday I went out for a hack where I knew that we would be cantering, so because I wanted to be sure that I could handle him in the canter without any problems whilst having to manage with double reins (which still feel like a handful of wet spaghetti somethimes!) I reverted to my usual French Link.   I worked at getting him on the bit and using his back properly during walk and trot on the hack and enjoyed the canter without worrying about jabbing him with unfamiliar bit /reins.

I got some strange looks at my yard when I started trying to school Red in a pelham, as the general opinion is that you should persevere with a snaffle, but after one lesson where I was trying to get him 'on the bit' and my fingers had gone numb and my arms ached, I could not help but wonder how his mouth was feeling if that was how my arms felt!  I decided to give the pelham a go and he is begining to learn and without so much pressure on my arms  - it is definately not the easy option!.  

Most of the riders I know do not worry too much about schooling their horse to go properly, but simply get on and ride - it shows a good approach from you that you are even asking the question!  Keep up with the enquiring mind!

Sarah  

[karen]

Sarah, I have to agree with your comments, after riding my horse for years in a snaffle, because that was the done thing where I ride, I eventually tried him in a pelham  and the change was amazing.  I was the same when riding him in a snaffle, - my fingers aching and going numb, feeling like my shoulders were being pulled out of my sockets! Now he is light, and softer, and much less resistant. I'm sure he must feel more comfortable with the lighter contact I have now.  There are some horses who just do not go well in a snaffle.  It's great if your hourse does, but if not it is definately worth it to try a pelham.  
 

[KathyGrant]

Thanks for all the replies guys. However, no-one mentioned a mullen mouth snaffle (or any other unjointed bit for that matter). That cannot have the nutcracker action Heather talks about in her book and video. Conversely, a jointed pelham could have this action.

Help!!! I'm beginning to feel completely in the dark!  

Kathy.

PS. Pete, thanks for the offer of help, but as I'm as yet horseless, I won't drag you all the way to South Norfolk!   However, I would appreciate seeing someone nearer to home to perhaps ride a horse in a Pelham, just to see what it's like. I live between Thetford and Diss, if that's any help, not far from the ILPH in Snetterton.

[nix]

Hi Kathy

Just to add my "two-penceworth"   ! A mullen-mouth snaffle acts only on the bars of the mouth, tongue and lips. The mullen-mouth pelham is a hanging-cheek type bit and using the snaffle rein acts as above, but also has some poll action. Obviously, with the curb rein you have a greater effect on the poll and the action on the curb groove.

My TB loves his mullen-mouth pelham, but dislikes a hard rubber mullen-mouth snaffle. I have wondered whether this is because the bit is attached directly to the cheek pieces as opposed to a hanging mouth ... I have thought about trying a hanging cheek mullen-mouth hard rubber snaffle, but can't really justify the £45 when he's happy in his pelham!

Hope this helps.

[karen]

Kathy, Heather doesn't recommend using a mullen mouth pelham versus a snaffle to avoid the pinching action necessarily.  It is recommended because of the poll pressure and the effect of the curb chain, which causes the horse to relax in the jaw and come into a better frame.  It is true that the mullen mouth snaffle would not have the pinching action, but it nevertheless is a snaffle bit, which would not have the effect a that pelham would.
I personally think that it would be much less likely to cause pain or damage to a horses mouth using a pelham, with a light contact, than riding a horse in a snaffle which is hanging, resistant, and a ton weight in your hands.  This is how my horse was in a snaffle, and I am sure he could not have been comfortable.
A jointed pelham changes the action of the curb...if you look at my earlier post about the difference between mullen mouth and jointed pelhams you will see Heather's explanation of the difference.  

[KathyGrant]

Karen, thank you for that. The picture is beginning to become clearer.

I think one of my main concerns is that of someone who has yet to develop a truly independent seat (and thereby not being able to achieve a light contact), using a pelham. I hear what people have said about such a person inflicting pain with any type of bit, but surely the risk is greater with a pelham, especially as it works on several parts (and more parts than other bits, eg. snaffle) of the horse's head at once?

Also, if one has managed to achieve the correct outline in one's horse, and it is on the bit etc., does one then change back to a snaffle (or whatever was being used originally)? Is it used as a training/remedial bit until the problem is solved? Or does one have to continue using the pelham for fear of the old habits returning?

I hope you'll forgive me for harping on about this, but I do want to really understand about this. What puzzles me is this: if this bit seems to be the answer to many problems, why isn't it more widely used? Surely there can't be that many ignorant people around? (Or are there?  <_<) And why isn't it allowed in dressage tests?

I find this subject very interesting, and one worthy of in-depth discussion, as the welfare of the horse is paramount, and I would like to be able to say to anyone, that my horse (whenever I get it!) is in such-and-such a bit because I consider it to be the most appropriate and comfortable one for it.

Sorry this has been so long. I guess it's my post-degree enquiring mind still at work!

Kathy.

[Sarah]

hi Kathy,

I htink the golden rule with bitting is that there is no golden rule!

Some horses will ahppily go back into the snaffle after a few weeks of work in a pelham, others may take a lot longer, some may just not like the snaffle action (even with a mullen nouth) so may remain in the pelham.  To be honest you just have to look at the horse's mouth conformation, think about things then try a bit and be prepared to change if your horse isn't happy.  There wouldn't be so many bits for sale in tack shops if all horses were happy in one type i guess!

i think the reason Heather advocates use of the pelham is that most riders use a snaffle.  If the horse is poorly educated then he will learn to turn off to the snaffle actrion adn using the pelham which acts on different part fo teh horse will enable the rider to communicate better with teh horse.  Once te horse has learnt what the rider is after with the rein aids, he can often then transfer that knowledge to another type of bit.

The pelham isn't widely used i think as for it to be effective you need to use 2 reins.  Many riders are concerned about swopping to 2 sets of reins so don't try it.  The majority of times you see a pelham it is with roundings and one set of reins.

Lots of different types of bits aren't allowed in dressage, gags, hackmores, etc, etc, it isn't just the pelham that is being picked on!

bye!

[karen]

Kathy I totally understand your concern that riders who have not yet developed an independent may cause pain or discomfort to the horse with a pelham.  I don't think I have a  totally independent seat yet,  but I didn't just stick a pelham in my horses mouth, and jump on and ride regardless. I had my instructor with me to explain the differences between using a snaffle and a pelham and how to ride with the pelham, and yes, you do have to be a bit more careful with your hands when using a pelham.   On the other hand, in my case, my horse became so much softer and responsive that I could be much softer with my hands anyway.
The pelham can be used as a remedial training bit in many cases, and the horse can then go back into a snafle bit.  However, there are some horses which will never go well in a snaffle, and then, if you want to compete, you have the option of switching to a double bridle, and waiting until you have trained your horse up to elementary level.  
I am trying my horse periodically in a snaffle...I tried him today, and he is getting gradually better in it, but is still very difficult compared to riding him in a pelham.  At the moment my instructor is saying that perhaps I could ride him in a pelham every day, and then just for the day of the competition put him back in a snaffle, as we do't hink he will ever go well in a snaffle long term.  Otherwise we keep training until I am good enough to take him at elementary level.
As to why it isn't allowed in dressaged tests, like a lot of other bits, I guess it is because they don't want one rider to have an advantage over another, or maybe they feel that riders below elementary level do not have the skill to ride in pelham.
Does anyone know what the reason is?

[KathyGrant]

Thanks everyone. I really do appreciate all your replies. This is what is needed. You don't get all this information and these tips from books and magazine articles (although some are better than others). What is really helpful is people's own experiences, which are sometimes not following the "rules", but which work nevertheless.

Please keep your anecdotes coming!  

Kathy.  

[Sarah B]

The lady who runs my yard always laughs whenever I come down with some new idea I have got from reading a book or magazine article - and reminds me that the problem is that horses don't read!!  Having said that, she is always open to me trying out new ideas and helping me to do so!

You are so right - nothing beats the advice you get from people with genuine, hands-on experience of what works and what doesn't - which you can listen to with an open mind and experiment with!!  Just like people, horses are all different and what works with one will fail with another!


Sarah  

[Pete]

At risk of being controversial, there's a lot of things in dressage that dont make sense - I think much of the rules are hangovers from some dreary 'old school' thinking that never changed with the times... what's wrong with using a seatbone saver to ride a test - does it give 'unfair advantage'?  I think not.... but its a rule... Many of the bits that are allowed are hard on the horse and force them into unnatural outlines - in the right hands, a pelham is very gentle.  The whole dressage system needs complete overhaul - it is archaic, badly judged and hardly encourages excellence - look at the performance of the british team in the World Equestrian Games.  Dont get me wrong - there are some very frustrated and enlightened people in the system - I talked to one British judge who is banging his head against a brick wall trying to introduce change and improve things - they know WHY the system doesnt work - but the system wont allow change.  Its one reason that we want to start our own system within EE for members to compete and learn....