"stop Hovering"

[pintopiaffe]

While I am positively THRILLED with our performance last week, and really, really pleased with the pictures... I notice in most my lower leg is *still* too far back.  My upper body is much better, but just a hair in front of the verticle.

Doing photo critiques are hard--since the photo is static, and the subject is not--but one friend pointed out that I *did* have a straight line ears-elbows-hips-heels, *but* it was slightly slanted--the top of the line just forward of verticle, the bottom just behind.

Another said 'there's just something funky going on in your seat, but I don't know *what*.'  

Since my instruction is so few and far between (hoping to squeeze one more in before real winter sets in provided things come together--the truck has been NOT cooperating and feeling VERY unwell though  :(  ) I am always looking for things I can try on my own that don't require eyes on the ground.

One simple cure for the legs... tie the stirrups to the girth.  Obviously with a bit of play, but not so much that my legs can get so far back.  There are fancy safety straps to do this with, but back in the day, we did it with good old baling twine.  Before I spent the $$ on the retail straps, (or the creativity and $ on a homemade version) I figured I'd try the twine and see if it would work.

WHAT A REVELATION!   :blink:

From the moment I got in the saddle I could feel how I wanted to put my feet too far back.  And when I couldn't, my upper body felt very upright and natural, and my seat felt ENTIRELY different.  I realized a couple of things;  My hips need to be even MORE open (groan...  :blink:  didn't think THAT was possible) my calves needed to do MUCH more aiding than they were (heels wanted to creep up--part of the 'back' thing) but the biggest was how much weight I had in the stirrups and not in my seat.  Was only a brief ride due to work and schedule and such, but eyeopening.  

Then in a phone conversation last night with a faraway friend who has been teaching French/Portuguese school for a very long time... she put her finger on something that NO one has... and that I had already started to realize.

She said, "You need to STOP HOVERING and SIT DOWN on him."

Sounds simple enough.  I mean, I ride bareback... and when I'm bareback he goes WONDERFULLY... and when I'm bareback, I have no CHOICE but to let my weight into my seat and upper thighs...    DOH!!!

It's a phenomenon she's seen in other large riders--or just riders who THINK they are large.  (women--never seen a man *hover* unless he was protecting himself in a poor fitting saddle... )  

Now, we're not talking 'taking a bit of weight into the stirrups' as when you piaffe or passage... or, rather, I guess we *are*, but I unconsciously do that ALL THE TIME.  I think it's a defensive mechanism, a subconscious thing that I want to protect and save the horse's back...

But Mac can easily carry me.  Will he carry me BETTER in 50lbs more lost?  Of course.   But smaller horses have carried larger men for very long periods of time doing much harder work... and lived.      I recall when I worked on the Ranch, for the hardest work--longest hours, or faster, more intense work--my favorite horses were very small, 13.3-14.2, tops.  When I first started there I always went for the big 16h guys, then soon realized the smaller ones were handier and hardier and we fared much better for the really tough stuff like moving cattle or pushing the herd of 110 horses to winter pasture etc.  

I think when my teacher wants me to 'post higher' it's not so much that he wants more air time, but what that is accomplishing is sitting deeper when I sit the post.  

I'm not quite sure how I'm going to 'translate' this into practice... I am going to tie the stirrups for a bit, that's for sure... and drop them for more of the time as well... more bareback is a given now that it's almost snow season.  (Already chose bb over the saddle 2x last week because it was just too raw and cold, and it's not even winter yet!   )

I'm very hopeful that this is kind of that last piece of the puzzle so to speak.  We've been progressing in leaps and bounds, but still been just shy of really, truly correct position on my part.  

(I *am* asking Santa to help fund a trip to Heather's next year--I just think the equistimulator is exactly what I need, since I don't process learning quite as easily as I could, and I'm definitely not a biomechanically-feeling rider...     )

Would love to hear from anyone whose overcome this... or just anyone who might be experiencing the same.  It's probably a very, very long ingrained habit, since I've pretty much always been heavy for my size.

attching a couple of photos just for reference--these are where friend spotted the issue.  

[pintopiaffe]

now this is a bit of an odd moment--I've just had him change behind as he was cross cantering, AND I'm trying to really keep him out on the circle as he's shying away from the puddle on the rail... still, it illustrates the point.  (and aside from being too short in the neck, you can really see nice engagement of the hind end, his back is filled really 'up' and articulation of all the joints... )

 

[lmevans]

Hi there fellow pinto lover !!!

just a quick note on your pics - I'm a bit of a 'hoverer' too, big moving warmblood cross (piebald, naturally!) and I tend to hover in trot as a means of preventing myself being propelled skywards by his enormous trot, then smacking back to earth on his back in the down phase.

From your pictures, especially the second one, I think your hand position may also be contributing to the hover. Your hands seem to be set a bit on the low side, down either side of his withers. Now I appreciate the use of a low hand carriage in a more novice horse, but in this instance I think it is unbalancing you forwards, tipping your seat out of the saddle and increasing the hover. Does that make any sense????

If you want to lower your hands for a reason, try and do it by opening out your elbow and keeping your upper body upright rather than leaning forward to give your hands down and forward. This is harder if you have short arms - can't really tell from the photo - mine are like an orangutan so not a problem I know how to fix, sorry!   A balance strap fixed from D to D on the saddle can help to re-accustom yourself to bringing your upper body back. Only needs to be about 6-8 inches long, and you just tuck your little fingers through it while holding the reins normally and it help you to learn to rebalance your hands and upper body without interferring with the horse.

i used to do all of the above, setting hands too low, tipping body forwards and legs back , but re-placing my hands a bit higher and rebalancing my body position has helped to cure it almost completely (note the almost!!!).

Good luck

Lucie and Casper xx

[pintopiaffe]

ah, yes Lucie!!

We've been working on that very thing for most of the last 3 months.  When he was younger my teacher would have me use a lower/wider/steadier rein (think 'be the sidereins"... lol!) but he really doesn't need that any more.  *I* still revert in times of stress.  Plus, since I lost my mare, he's the only horse I ride, and I tend to get in more ruts that way.  (If I rode her with hands too low, she'd end up curled behind the bit with her nose around her knees  :blink: )

I do have short arms.  AND they're having to learn to hang differently since loosing 50lbs (with 50 more to go)  

It's rather a chicken-and-egg thing... when I have the upper body back, the arms hang more vertically and because the elbows are correct, the hands come up and are softer.  OTOH, thinking about fixing those elbows and lifting the hands gets me sitting much more UP and elegant.

NONE of that happens though with my feet so far back since there's no base of support.

Thinking about it more and making yesterday's entry in his journal, I realized it's gotten a bit worse as summer progressed for a few reasons... All winter I rode bareback and western, alternating with his dressage saddle that he was outgrowing.  I became very defensive/protective of him in the dressage saddle... but then when we switched to the Flexion, his movement became so much BIGGER.  Now, that's a GOOD THING, no doubt, but man-oh-man it's a growth spurt for the rider.  :P

Rode for 40 minutes without stirrups yesterday.  The trot improved nicely.  (sitting)  It was WORK for both of us--it was hard for him not to just go sproinging forward in a very hefty medium.   Two or three times after a corner or a good rebalance on my part, he lifted right up in front and it was like flying... (of course, then it was hard to get MY balance again to bring him back to something I could sit... lol!)

I do believe we're going to spend quite some time without stirrups...  :unsure:  

[stranger]

I got told off for 'hovering' last week as well by my RWYM instructor. MY BHS trainer wants me to 'stay down in the saddle longer' at rising trot-so I think he is saying the same thing in a different 'language'.


My lower leg postion however seems to depend on my instructor of the moment.
.
My BHS trainer says 'bring it forward to control the shoulder'.
My RWYM  instructor wants its back and under me for my own balance.

I have always been a bit sceptical about 'tying the strirrup'-but from what you have said it might be worth trying the experiment.

I tend to tip back and hollow out--due I think to my preference for riding very onward bound and strong lively horses.  RWYM calls it 'water-ski-ing' although I am assured that I do not use my hands/reins/bit as a balancing rod and indeed I dont think that I do.


 

[pintopiaffe]

Took me a minute--RWYM--a Mary Wanless teacher?

I don't think tying the stirrups is necessarily the best choice... but given the lack of eyes on the ground, it's a way for me to tell just HOW far back I was letting my legs go.  Very eye-opening.

Haven't been on in a whole week due to foal watch and truck problems.   <_<   Hoping to get some time in tomorrow.